SHOAN

Interview with guitarist Otto Marsili and vocalist/guitarist Pascal Remans (2004)

Pascal, prior to SHOAN you were the vocalist of BREATHLESS. Exactly when did that band come to an end? And what caused this? Were you involved with any other bands or projects after BREATHLESS and prior to SHOAN?
Pascal : I guess splitting up with BREATHLESS was around 1986. The other members of BREATHLESS were really into speed and heavy metal but my influences got in a different direction, more like QUEENSRYCHE, YNGWIE MALMSTEEN, RUSH, … that kind of bands. After the split all my energy and time went to SHOAN.
When you were in BREATHLESS you were just the vocalist. In SHOAN you handled the guitar as well. How did this come about? Had you always been playing guitar, or did you start out after BREATHLESS broke up?
Pascal : Well, in those days almost every metal band had two leadguitar players. Otto Marsili (WESTFALEN) was very interested in me as a singer, and I really wanted to work with him for his guitar skills, but Otto also knew me as a guitar player. In BREATHLESS I only did lead vocals but I started playing guitar when I was 13 years old, so by the time me and Otto got together I already played the guitar for 4 years. We also had the same influences on guitar (Yngwie Malmsteen, Vinnie Moore, Joe Satriani, Paul Gilbert) so we figured, why bother trying to find a second guitar player? At the same time I knew I was facing a lot of hard work, because I had to combine complex guitar riffs and solos with lead vocals, but it worked out pretty well.
By the way, were you in any other bands prior to BREATHLESS?
Pascal : No, as there was this other thing in my life called school! Not that I really cared, haha.
Chris Willems (drums), Roger Grossard (bass) and Otto were all former members of WESTFALEN, so I’m wondering when and why that band called it quits?
Pascal : I remember WESTFALEN splitting up around the same time as BREATHLESS did. I also remember them not being happy with their lead singer. His singing style attached them to plain old heavy metal and they were searching for new horizons.
Roger was a member of NATION in between WESTFALEN and SHOAN, I believe? Were Chris and Otto involved in any other bands/projects in between WESTFALEN and SHOAN?
Pascal : That’s right : in between WESTFALEN and SHOAN Roger was a member of NATION. The first drummer of WESTFALEN (Roberto Rossi) was a member too. As far as I know Chris and Otto weren’t involved in other bands/projects in between WESTFALEN and SHOAN.
Again, were Chris, Otto and/or Roger active in any other bands prior to WESTFALEN?
Pascal : I’m pretty sure they weren’t.
Depending on various sources, SHOAN started out in either late summer 1986, October/November 1986 or late 1986, so I’m wondering when SHOAN was founded exactly? And how did this come about exactly? How did you all join forces?
Pascal & Otto : If you wanna know an exact date : September 1986. But hey, it was a long time ago, so maybe you’d better check with the other guys first, before taking our word for it! There was this hard rock pub called ‘De Oude Tijd’ in Genk, where Otto and I used to hang out : you know, drinking a lot of beer, chasing women and talking about nothing else but music! From time to time Otto came to my place where we played guitar and worked on songs or ideas. That really went great, so after a while we started talking about forming a band. Chris was immediately interested and Roger wasn’t really happy with NATION, so … All the blanks were filled in.
Who came up with the name SHOAN and what does it mean?
Pascal : Otto first came up with SHOAH, but that wasn’t such a good idea. Shoah is a Hebrew word which means the holocaust in World War II and of course there was NO WAY we wanted people to think we had some kind of sympathy for this horrible fact in history! A friend of ours said : If you like the way SHOAH sounds, why not change one character and make it for example SHOAN? And that’s how we got our bandname. SHOAN is a non-existing word!
And who came up with the SHOAN logo?
Otto : A good friend of Pascal, Werner Donné.
From what I’ve heard SHOAN used to play covers by the likes of AC/DC, DEEP PUPLE, YNGWIE MALMSTEEN, ... in the early days. Did you just play those in rehearsal or also during live gigs? Which songs did you cover exactly? Any other bands/songs as well?
Otto & Pascal : We never actually played any covers, we only ‘jammed’ through covers during rehearsals. The only time we actually played a cover was during one live gig. Sorry, I can’t remember where, but I think it was our last gig. We played VAN HALEN's Panama on that occasion. During rehearsals we jammed on lots of YNGWIE MALMSTEEN songs, but also QUEENSRYCHE, VAN HALEN, HELLOWEEN, IRON MAIDEN, ACCEPT, AC/DC (pure fun!) and even MANOWAR, haha! Songtitles? Let me think … Half of YNGWIE MALMSTEEN’s repertoire at that time, Take Hold Of The Flame (QUEENSRYCHE), Panama (VAN HALEN), A Tale That Wasn’t Right (HELLOWEEN), The Trooper (IRON MAIDEN), Starlight & Breaking Up Again (ACCEPT), Back In Black (AC/DC), Blood Of My Enemies (MANOWAR). It was fun!
Do you remember what the first original song was that SHOAN composed? When and why did you switch from doing cover material to start composing original songs?
Pascal & Otto : That must have been Power’s On Our Side. To get back on covering : we were never really interested in covers.
Who was responsible for the songwriting in SHOAN? Was it a band effort, or rather a more individual approach?
Otto : All of the songs were composed by me and Pascal. For example : sometimes I had a riff or a theme on guitar and introduced it to Pascal. Together we started working on the rhythm guitar parts, mixing it with some vocal melody lines … No lyrics, just nonsense … You should have heard us, haha! Then we continued working out the song until we had a rough copy of it. After that we brought out the song to the rest of the band during rehearsal, and while they joined in we finished of the song. Voila!
And who came up with the lyrics? What inspired those lyrics to begin with?
Otto : Pascal wrote all of the lyrics. The ups and downs in life always were a great source of inspiration.
SHOAN was often compared to QUEENSRYCHE and YNGWIE MALMSTEEN. How did it make you feel when you first heard these comparisons? Do you agree, or not at all?
Otto & Pascal : To be compared to bands of that level of course was a very big compliment, and we do agree that we did sound a bit like them, but in the process of growing as a band we were focusing more on creating our own sound.
By which bands and individuals were you guys influenced in those days?
Pascal : In those days we were mainly very influenced by all the guitar orientated metal bands, you name them … But we’ve always been very open-minded, and as such we listened to a lot of experimental bands like QUEEN, RUSH, THE BEATLES, PINK FLOYD, … as well.
Some classical influences made their way into SHOAN’s sound as well, right? How did this come about? Who was into classical stuff to begin with?
Otto & Pascal : To be honest, we weren’t very influenced by classical music at all, but we’ve always liked playing harmonic scales in our solos. By playing these scales you automatically create a dark, dramatic, melodic and classical sound.
On January 31st 1987 SHOAN played live in Maasmechelen, as support to XES. BATTALION was the opening band on that occasion. I suppose that this was one of the band’s first gigs, if not the very first? What do you remember from that particular occasion? Attendance, crowd reaction, performance, ... And what do you recall from both other bands?
Pascal : That was indeed our first live gig. I remember a very crowded Jagersborg (name of the hall) and, since we were playing for the first time on a live stage with SHOAN, we were all very excited! The crowd reaction was absolutely great, maybe because of the fact that we had a different approach to metal. I guess we didn’t sound like other bands at that time here in Belgium. I can’t really remember the other bands; I guess we were too busy doing whatever in our dressing room or backstage. We did know the guitar player of XES (Clarence Akkermans), as he once was a member of BLACK WIDOW.
Further on the subject of live gigs : you also played a gig in Holland once, I believe? What was that all about? How did a ‘foreign’ audience react to SHOAN, compared to your local Belgian following?
Otto : We played three gigs in Holland : one in Roermond, another during a festival at Eindhoven’s Dynamo club, and at Katwijk’s Scum. I must say that the crowd reaction in Roermond and Katwijk was great, but at the Dynamo festival we were playing for a thrash metal audience. The response at that gig was good, but not overwhelming. We didn’t really fit in there!
Early on in SHOAN’s career the band didn’t play very often, which was mainly due to the fact that Pascal had to fulfill his military service, right? Do you have any idea as to how many shows SHOAN played over the course of its existence?
Pascal : We did most of the shows only in Belgium, very irregular. It’s kinda hard to tell, but during that period it wasn’t very often.
Can you give us a rundown of some of the other bands that you shared the stage with as SHOAN? Any international bands as well?
Otto : No international bands. We once did a show with KILLER, but most of our gigs were without any support act.
Can you describe a typical SHOAN live show? Did you have any special effects or treats for the audiences?
Otto : No, just music!
What’s the strangest thing that ever occurred during a SHOAN live show?
Otto & Pascal : As far as we remember, nothing weird or strange ever happened during our live shows.
The first SHOAN recording that I’m aware of is a 2-song demo (including Hard Love and Music Or Love), which I believe dates back to 1987? Exactly when and where were those two songs recorded? And what do you remember from those sessions?
Pascal : That must have been around late 1986 at Studio 8 in Genk. The recording sessions went really fast; maybe 2 or 3 takes for the instrumental parts and a few takes for the vocal parts.
That first tape received favourable reviews in fanzines and magazines from Belgium (Metaliferous, Metal Paper, Metallised) as well as Holland’s Aardschok/Metal Hammer. Do you recall any others, perhaps from other countries as well? How was the feedback, in general?
Otto : There were some very good reviews from some of the local magazines. I can’t remember any names, but in general we always had very positive feedback.
Was that tape actually available to the general public, or was it just a promotional tool to get gigs, send out to the media, ...? Why was that? And why only two songs?
Pascal & Otto : That demo tape was recorded only for promotion and of course we also wanted to have an idea of how we really sounded. Since we just started rehearsing with the band for a few months, we didn’t have more material ready for recording.
Can you tell us something about the lyrical background as far as those two songs are concerned?
Pascal : They’re both love songs with a rough edge. Music Or Love tells the story (very familiar to musicians) of a person who has to decide if he wants to have a relationship with his partner or with his music. The energy and time he spends on being a musician makes it very hard to have a ‘normal’ relationship, so his partner objects, haha! Hard Love is a whole different story! First and for all, it’s NOT about me!!! It’s about a guy having trouble with his girlfriend because she keeps forcing him to have SM sex … So … Like I already said : lyrics about all the ups and downs in life!
Had you recorded any other songs or demos prior to this? Or did you record any more songs during those sessions that didn’t end up being released?
Otto : No.
How many original songs had you written at that time? And how did you select the songs to record and release? Why those two songs in particular?
Pascal & Otto : Around that time we’d written five or six songs, without counting the two demo songs. Those songs weren’t really finished, so they didn’t make the demo.
By early 1988 SHOAN had already written at least 12 original songs, one of them being Streetlaw. Can you share some of the other songtitles that eventually were never released with us? What were these songs like, musically?
Otto & Pascal : Actually, there’s a thirteenth song named No Time For Losers; a very heavy and fast song. And there were two other songs developing in a different direction. Very melodic songs, with more room for vocals. But they never got finished, so they remained untitled.
On July 2nd 1988 SHOAN played in Zutendaal, together with ADVANCE and FIRST LADY. What do you recall from that show? And about the other two bands?
Otto : I remember that show because someone was filming it. I’m still wondering who that guy was! There were a few members of the other bands that I knew as friends, but I can’t remember any further details about that night, sorry! And by looking at the expression on Pascal’s face … that goes for him too!
What was the Belgian metal scene in general like back in those days? Did you all get along fine, helping each other out as much as possible, or rather the contrary? Why? Did you have a lot of contact with other bands? Which ones?
Pascal & Otto : The 1980’s were a difficult time in Belgium for rock or metal bands. The best option we had was working together with other bands as much as possible, but on the other hand we didn’t really have a lot of contact with other bands.
SHOAN’s second sign of life was the Escape ... demo, which was released in 1989. Once again, when and where were those songs recorded?
Otto & Pascal : Those songs were recorded late 1988 in the same studio as our first demo, Studio 8 in Genk.
Escape ... included a total of seven songs : five new ones plus both songs from the 1987 tape. Why did you decide to include those two songs again? And are those re-recorded versions, or the exact same ones?
Pascal : We wanted to have both demos on one tape. The songs from our first demo weren’t re-recorded.
Escape ... is the only instrumental SHOAN tune that I’m aware of. I’m wondering if you had any other instrumentals at the time?
Pascal : No.
And what can you tell us about the lyrical content of the remaining four new songs (Higher, Visions, Make Me Understand and Fighting Ourselves)?
Pascal : Higher was about making a dream come true, while Visions was pure fiction. You Make Me Understand was a love story and Fighting Ourselves was about society.
How would you describe SHOAN’s style yourself? And how did this style compare to your former bands, BREATHLESS and WESTFALEN?
Otto : Compared to our former bands, SHOAN had a much more complex and modern sound, with lots of guitar-aerobics!
I don’t recall any reviews of Escape ... so I’m wondering how many copies of Escape ... you did spread/sell in total? Which channels of distribution did you use at the time?
Pascal & Otto : The demo wasn’t meant for sale, just for promotion.
And how were the reactions towards it, both from fans and media, in general?
Pascal : Very positive, maybe because we didn’t sound like most of the other bands at that time.
Did SHOAN record/release any more songs/demos after Escape ...? Or did you at least write any more new songs? Any songtitles that you can give away?
Otto : There were no further releases or demos after Escape ... We did have more songs, to name a few : No Time For Losers, All Yours Tonight, and many others that never got finished.
In hindsight, don’t you think that it would’ve made more of an impact had SHOAN released some kind of vinyl release, be it an EP or LP, in stead of just demos?
Pascal : Of course, like every other band we dreamed of being signed up for a record-deal, but I guess the band split up a little too soon.
Why didn’t you release any SHOAN vinyl by yourselves instead? Was it a matter of lack of funds, or were there any other factors involved? It’s just strange that SHOAN didn’t release any vinyl, knowing that you all released vinyl with your previous bands.
Otto & Pascal : The main reason for that probably is this : by the time we considered ourselves good enough as a band and ready to put our music on vinyl, we decided to split due to certain circumstances.
What happened with SHOAN after the release of Escape ...? Did you still continue to play live? Details?
Pascal : In that period we didn’t do concerts very often because I was forfilling my military duty.
When and why did SHOAN finally disband? Was it a mutual agreement or did one or more members just quit?
Pascal & Otto : Around early 1989. There were some disagreements between us all, and I guess we were too empty-headed to work things out!
Do you have any explanation as to why SHOAN never achieved bigger things, despite the obvious musical talent and a professional attitude?
Otto : Maybe just bad timing!!??
I know that it was your dream to become professional musicians in those days, so I wonder whatever became of that dream in the end? What have all four of you been up to as far as music is concerned? Please list all possible bands and projects that you’ve been involved with ever since the end of SHOAN? Styles? Any releases? Recordings? Are you still actively involved in any bands nowadays?
Otto & Pascal : During the first years after the split we were all focusing on our personal lives, and after a while we started doing covers (all around) with all kinds of bands (too many to mention). There never were any more recordings.
Have their been any SHOAN reunion gigs ever since the break-up? Would you ever consider doing a reunion gig, or even a permanent reunion? Why?
Otto : No, and I don’t think a reunion will ever take place. Pascal and I remained friends over the years, but the other members of SHOAN went their own way.
And did you ever consider releasing SHOAN’s music properly, be it on vinyl or CD? In this day and age it’s rather easy to release them on your own, right? Besides, there are still a couple smaller record companies that are still releasing undiscovered metal music gems these days.
Otto & Pascal : To be honest, we never really thought about that! We still have the original studio tapes and perhaps some day we might put it on CD, but that would be self-indulgent.
Did any of you ever consider creating a SHOAN website? And what do you think of the Internet yourself?
Pascal & Otto : We don’t really see the use of that, but we love the Internet. Maybe if we had had the same possibilities then as we have now as musicians, we might have advanced a lot further!
What are your best memories of your time in SHOAN?
Otto : We were all very young and we absolutely had no responsibilities towards anyone or anything! The only thing we had on our mind was rehearsing with the band and going out to party! Especially after our gigs we had some great parties!
And what about your worst memories?
Pascal & Otto : The day after … You know … Having a party!!!
Is there anything about SHOAN that must be revealed at all cost? Be my guest ...
Otto & Pascal : Nothing that we know of!
Any final comments?
Otto & Pascal : Actually, we were VERY surprised by all the information you somehow managed to find on SHOAN, and of course we were a little flattered too! Thanks for the interview, we enjoyed it a lot!